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Thursday, June 16, 2005

Please Tell Me I'm Wrong

This morning Ms. Limburg and I were discussing Sen. Durbin's now infamous remarks, and we eventually settled on the only possible explanation being that's he's a complete and utter moron. It's like he did a Google for "really bad people" and just wrote down the first three names that popped up. With all the attention it's been getting, I expected a full apology from Dick by today, but instead we get this:

"This administration should apologize to the American people for abandoning the Geneva Conventions and authorizing torture techniques that put our troops at risk and make Americans less secure."
And it gets worse. The Daily Kos, a virtual Mecca for the new Democratic Party, is falling over itself to defend Durbin's remarks, declaring that:

"And let's not forget, "torture" was used as a rationale for this war -- as in, we'll invade and end the torture. Of course, none of that has happened. The torture that was so bad under Saddam, is equally bad under U.S. command. And Dick Durbin had the balls to say it so on the Senate
This simply makes no sense. Liberals with half a brain cell are trying to distance themselves from the Gitmo accusations, considering it's starting to look more like Club Med the more we hear about it. When a US Senator makes a statement like this, anyone who ever wants to be taken seriously again should run as far from him as possible. It's not happening.

Please tell me this is a joke. Please tell me the Vast Left Wing Conspiracy set this up to pull one over on the Right. If the Left stands behind Durbin's statements, then any hope that the Democrats can play a constructive role in the War on Terror is gone forever. They've lost touch with reality.


Blogger Nedhead said...

I read your post, I read FoxNews report, I read the excerpt from congressional record.

Where is the vast Left Wing Conspiracy? Did you read the FBI statement that Durbin quoted? Do you think the actions described in the FBI quote are acceptable?

What would be the harm if Bush came out and said, "Yes, there has been some mistreatment of detainees at some of our detention centers. The acts are reprehensible, and if some of our policies have led to this behavior, then changes must be made. I apologize to the world community and will direct our military and consulting personnel running our various centers to obey the tenets of the Geneva Convention. Thank you and good night."

Why are the you so uptight about Durbins statements? If he is mis-speaking and has it all wrong, then just let him hang himself, no? What is the best way to convince someone you're guilty? Get all defensive, that's how! Knee-jerk reactions tend to lend creedence to someone's statement.

I agree with the concern at comparing Gitmo with Pol Pot, Stalin, Nazi's, etc. A little hyperbole, no? A good way to draw attention to yourself. I don't believe the current situation comes anywhere near (I mean different universe) the atrocities of the referenced regimes, and drawing parallels stretches the imagination a bit. BUT, as with my responses to your original Gitmo post, human rights are a serious matter to many people. (We may not agree on what those rights are, for sure). Any violation of same should, in my opinion, warrant a serious and vehement outcry. I agree with Durbin when he says, "If we
want standards of civilized conduct to be applied to Americans captured in a warlike situation, we have to extend the same manner and type of treatment to those whom we detain, our prisoners."

And I concur when Pete Peterson (referenced by Durbin) writes, "We need absolute clarity that America will continue to set the gold standard in the treatment of prisoners in wartime."

And lastly, Durbin states,
"The issue debated in the press today misses the point. The issue is not about closing Guantanamo Bay. It is not a question of the address of these prisoners. It is a question of how we treat these prisoners."

The references to the past atrocities was a very small part of a much larger statement. We must look at things much more holistically than we do (that goes for the left and the right).

6/16/2005 12:13:00 PM  
Blogger Brash Limburg said...

The whole point of my post is that fact that the Left refuses to denounce what he said. Considering that you have, don't you find that fact troubling? Rhetoric is one thing, but to defend a statement that is clearly indefensible speaks to the holy war the Left has against Bush. These are the same people who accuse people of faith of believing something so vehemently that they ignore science and everything else. Ironic no?

6/16/2005 12:31:00 PM  
Blogger Nedhead said...

Funny you should say Holy War......

6/16/2005 12:44:00 PM  
Blogger Nedhead said...

Brash, where in my post did I reference the Right? You know where? At the end, where I accuse the Left AND Right of committing the same error: taking quotes out of context.

I guess I am dumb. I didn't realize my responses are supposed to be Us against Them. From now on I will clearly state how evil and dirty the Right is and how pure and angelic the Left is. Would that satisfy the Reichwing?

Are we now going to discuss Person of faith vs. blind zealot? Should be a separate post.

6/16/2005 01:02:00 PM  
Blogger Brash Limburg said...

That's not a quote out of context. A qoute out of context is taking "I don't believe Hitler was the best thing to ever happen to the world" and making it "Hitler was the best thing to ever happen to the world"
The Durbin quote is fully intact, and in no way trys to manipulate the point he was trying to make.

Furthermore how am I making it us against them? I'm simply saying when someone says something dumb or offensive, distance yourself, don't pull your ranks tighter. Admittedly, that's something the Left and Right are both guilty of.

6/16/2005 01:24:00 PM  
Blogger Nedhead said...

I did not say you MISquoted Durbin, I am saying you took his quote out of context.

His statement was in relation to another statement in his presentation, which was further in relation to other statements in his speech. So on and so forth. But would it make good press to actually provide a complete story, no!

And see Brash, your closing paragraph makes me proud! You were able to make a conclusion without using labels! Excellent!

6/16/2005 01:49:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Adolf Hitler - About 9 million dead
Soviet gulags - About 2.7 million dead
Pol Pot - About 1.7 million dead
Gitmo - zero dead

6/17/2005 04:53:00 AM  

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